Sarah Brills Awesome Final Project!

Four Ways of a Person- Sheli sheli...

משנה מסכת אבות 

ה:ט ארבע מדות באדם, האומר שלי שלי ושלך שלך, זו מדה בינונית, ויש אומרים זו מדת סדום. שלי שלך ושלך שלי עם הארץ. שלי שלך ושלך שלך חסיד. שלי שלי ושלך שלי רשע

In the Talmud, (in volume Pirkei Avot, which deals with how to conduct ourselves)  we also learn about how  to think about self and other in respect to our property  and income versus another persons. Read the text above, and add your comments and thoughts below. 

Im Ain Ani Li...?

משנה מסכת אבות

א:יד הוא (הלל) היה אומר, אם אין אני לי, מי לי; וכשאני לעצמי, מה אני; ואם לא עכשיו, אימתיי.

This famous phrase by Rabbi Hillel tells us a lot about the attitude in Judaism of self vs. other

Add you comments and thought below

To Have a Standard

One thing we spoke about in class was the notion of a standard. In the text on בושת , we saw that the Mishnah says 'Everything is according to the one that embarrasses and the one that is embarrassed. Three rabbis give three different interpretations of one that means. Two use wealth, but another uses stature.

We spoke in class about how societies need to establish standards regarding wealth for a variety of reasons. Why? What are some different standards of wealth, privilege or stature that are used? Are there example of 'good' standards and 'bad' standards a society applies?

Teens, Photos, Internet and Embarrassment

The story below is of a Georgia teen who was embarrassment by a photograph the school of used of her, and sued the Georgia School District for $2 million for emotional distress. Read and comment below, and/or answer the questions.

http://www.thecitizen.com/articles/06-26-2013/one-peril-internet-posting-2-million-federal-lawsuit

When is embarrassment something you bring upon yourself, and when is someone else guilty of embarrassing you? Which is this a case of? Of the five categories of damage, should embarrassment be the most valuable, least valuable, or somewhere in between?

BK 86a Pt VII- Causing Shame

BK 86a Pt VII- Shame

 בושת- הכל לפי המבייש והמתבייש:   מני מתניתין? לא רבי מאיר ולא ר' יהודה אלא ר' שמעון היא, דתנן: וכולן רואין אותן כאילו הם בני חורין שירדו מנכסיהם, שהן בני אברהם יצחק ויעקב, דברי ר' מאיר. ר' יהודה אומר הגדול לפי גודלו והקטן לפי קטנו. רבי שמעון אומר עשירים רואין אותן כאילו הם בני חורין שירדו מנכסיהם, עניים כפחותין שבהן. מני ? <השתא> אי רבי מאיר מתניתין קתני: הכל לפי המבייש והמתבייש, ורבי מאיר כולהו בהדי הדדי נינהו! ואי ר' יהודה מתניתין קתני: המבייש את הסומא- חייב, ואילו ר' יהודה אומר סומא אין לו בושת. אלא לאו רבי שמעון היא? אפילו תימא ר' יהודה כי אמר ר' יהודה סומא אין לו בושת למשקל מיניה, אבל למיתבא ליה יהבינן ליה. והא מדקתני סיפא- המבייש את הישן- חייב. וישן שבייש פטור ולא קתני סומא שבייש פטור מכלל דלא שנא הכי ולא שנא הכי אלא מחוורתא מתניתין רבי שמעון היא:

(Mishnah) 

Everything is according to the one that shames and the one that is shamed. According to whom is our Mishnah? Not Rabbi Meir, and not Rabbi Yehuda, rather it is according to Rabbi Shimon.

As it is taught, 'everyone should be seen as if they were a free person that has declined in their wealth, since they are all the children of Abraham, Isaach and Jacob'- these are the words of Rabbi Meir. Rabbi Yehuda says, 'One that is great in stature, according to his/her greatness, and one that is lesser in stature, according to their (lack of) stature. Rabbi Shimon says, 'The wealthy should be seen as if they are free persons that have declined in their wealthy; the poor should be seen as the least among them

So, according to whom? Now, if it is taught according to Rabbi Meir, "everything is according to the one that shames and the one that is shame - here they are exactly the same! And if it is taught according to Rabbi Yehuda, the one who embarrasses a blind person is guilty, but according to Rabbi Yehuda, he would experience no embarrassment -so how can he be guilty? b

We can even say it could be according to Rabbi Yehuda, for Rabbi Yehuda would say a blind person -  has no capacity for shame- this applies if the blind person is the one that causes shame, since they
cannot see what they do, but if a blind person is embarrassed, they certainly should collect damages. e

Except that later on, our Mishnah exempts a blind man that causes embarrassment from paying damages for boshet, while Rabbi Yehudah does NOT exempt him. <Thus, our Mishnah cannot be according to Rabbi Yehuda> t 

 Rather it is according to Rabbi Shimon. n 

What do you think about the law regarding how we compensate a person that is embarrassed?Of the three opinions, is there one you prefer better than the eventual winner? And why would we list all three opinions if in the end, we only follow Rabbi Shimon? a

Conflict- to compensate? Or resolve?

Our Talmud has spend a lot of effort debating what is fair in paying money in the event one person hurts another intentionally.

But at our school as well as in life, when you and a friend fight- either physically or with words- there are other things that need to happen to get things 'right'. 

Comment below disagreements in your life and in the world, and  ways that people solve disagreements.